Lane Russell

Lane, what made you come and see England?

I’ve always been interested in the culture of the UK.  I read C.S. Lewis and I began to wonder why words that I knew such as ‘color’ were spelled differently plus having read about the American Revolution, I became interested in the UK’s involvement with that.

Where were you born?

I was born in Las Cruces, New Mexico.

Were you from a musical family?

My Dad is a great guitarist, from the Chet Atkins school.  He’s a fingerpicker and far better than I will ever be.  My Dad’s brother was also a musician and he very nearly recorded an album.  The men in the family are all pretty good musicians but none of the women are at all interested in music.

What kind of musical influences did you have growing up?

Neil Diamond.  Also, Kris Kristofferson.  I had a tiny record player. It was in a suitcase and folded out and on that I could play 33′s and 45′s.  I can remember The Eagles around that time and listening to them.  My Dad loved The Eagles.

In Middle School, I was crazy for The Monkees.  I liked the way they looked, the way they sounded.  I really identified with them and also I was drawn to Davy Jones, it was the British accent which I found really soothing.

I also loved programmes on the radio, anything from the 50′s and 60′s and I would record them relentlessly, sometimes waiting for several weeks to capture one song.  I also love Rock ‘n’ Roll.

Can you remember the moment when you realised you had to play guitar?

Yeah, about the twenty-thousandth time I heard David Gilmour’s guitar solo on “Comfortably Numb,” I said to myself. “Okay, I have GOT to figure out how he does that.”

Who is your most important musical influence?

Without a doubt, it is Lindsey Buckingham. I learned to play “The Chain,” as it was featured on the live album, “The Dance;” and after awhile, I was fingerpicking everything– mainly because I could never find a pick when I wanted one.

Was the guitar your first instrument?

My first instrument was the flute in 6th Grade.  It came as something of a surprise to me when I realised that I would have to practice.  I thought that that was why they gave us sheet music.

It was nearly 10 years later, 1994 when I first picked up the guitar and my brother taught me to play Pink Floyd’s Wish You Were Here. It took about 20 minutes or so because it’s not all that hard to play.

I must make mention of the guitar I saw you playing last week at The Butler and I see you’ve brought it along with you today. What type of instrument is it and what drew you to this as the guitar of choice?

It’s a Blackbird Rider and it costs about $1500 or $1800 for the full-size version.  I like it because it’s almost indestructible and impervious to the elements.  Because it has a carbon fibre body it won’t shrink or warp.  It has a brighter tone than most other acoustics and a wonderful sustain (which Lane ably demonstrates).

I must ask.  How did you, an American soldier, get to be standing on a tiny stage singing and playing the Blues in a crowded pub in the middle of Reading on a Saturday night?

Well, I was doing my laundry in Russell Street near to a convenience store.  I took my guitar along and was playing it while waiting and this chap came along, heard me play and told me about the Open Mic night at The Butler.  He couldn’t guarantee I’d get the chance to get up and play but I thought I’d still have an interesting night whatever happened so I went along anyway.

When you’re playing the Blues or just music in general, what are you feeling?

When I went through my divorce it tore my heart out and so I could bring a lot to what I was playing but when I got back into the church I found that although I could still play Blues in the sense of the form I no longer felt it.

That’s interesting.  So what’s your view about the Blues being the devil’s music?

Well, I’m of the belief that there’s no such thing as good or evil music.  Like there’s no such thing as a good or evil weapon.  A weapon is there to save the life of the wielder and music is like that.  Music is a gift to the musician.  It can save lives.  It can heal.

Why do you think the Blues still has relevance today?

Because it speaks to something common in all humanity.  It speaks to something inherent in the human condition.

Obviously, the Blues was a common thread in the lives of the people working on the cotton fields of the Mississippi Delta and was a way in which people could express their feelings and create something good out of the situations they found themselves in.  Is there a fear that now things are better for so many of us, the heart will be torn out of the Blues.  That it will be diluted in some way?

There will always be pain, always be misery so no I don’t think so.  The Blues will always be relevant.

Going back to when I first saw you play, I was struck by what I saw.  You were very conservatively attired yet playing this wild guitar.

Oh yeah, I like blowing people’s minds.  At some point when I get home I’m going to form a rock band and I’m going to call it One Trick Pony.  People will come along and listen and think that they’re only getting the one thing so it will come as a surprise when they hear Country one minute and Spinal Tap the next, maybe even some Broadway.  I love the song Stars from Les Miserables.  I’m moved by the character of Javert.  He is a tragic figure who’s essentially good but can’t handle it when his quarry shows mercy so kills himself.

~~~~~

At this point, Lane shows me how he learned to play Sweet Caroline but by using the chords to Fleetwood Mac’s Rhiannon.  It’s this eclectic approach which keeps his music so fresh and interesting to listen to and hard to believe that he’s only been playing for a decade and a half.   He tells me about the capo and how it’s used to change key before demonstrating songs which use it. I look at the clock and can’t believe so much time has passed.

It’s time for me to say goodbye but not before he’s played a song of Bonnie Raitt’s he loves.  I take some photos of his amazing guitar (see above) and he and I chat some more.  He tells me of a girl back home and I realise that so long as there are affairs of the heart, the Blues will never die.  He puts on his overcoat and Fedora.  I shake his hand and wish him well.  He picks up the guitar, clutches it to his chest and strides out into the evening rain.  I watch him for a long moment then he’s lost to the night.  There’s something quite dramatic yet perfectly fitting about that.

(This interview was conducted Thursday 12th November 2009)

Thank you to Lane, to Blackbird Guitars and to the staff of Picnic in the Butter Market for their hospitality and always friendly, polite service.

Rev Andrew Pakula

Could you tell me a bit about your upbringing? Were you from a large family? Were you brought up within a religious and/or spiritual tradition?

I grew up in a suburban New York Jewish family. We were culturally Jewish really – not particularly religious. In fact, we had a Christmas tree every year, which was a good deal because my sister and I got presents for both Hanukkah and Christmas. I suppose that sort of mixing of traditions was the beginning of my journey toward Unitarianism!

My family and I moved to the UK in 2006. We had never lived outside the US before, but have been very happy here in London.

You trained in an altogether different field to where you now find yourself didn’t you?

Oh yes, it’s been quite a long journey. I was a scientist and businessman. I have a lot of initials after my name (B.S., Ph.D., and MBA). To make a long story short, I studied and trained for many years, worked in Biotechnology for a while and then put all of that aside to become a Unitarian minister.

What led to you to become a Minister?

Umm… I don’t know.

Really? It seems like a rather big change to not know about…

Well, what I mean is that it just happened. It’s particularly odd when you consider that most of my life I was very anti-religious. I made Richard Dawkins look positively pious!  When my son was born, my wife and I decided to take him somewhere so he wouldn’t become a mass-murderer or a religious zealot (or both!) and someone told us about Unitarianism. It seemed safe enough, and the minister claimed that she was essentially an atheist, so we gave it a try.

Then, something happened and I got hooked. It wasn’t a religious experience in the traditional dramatic smoke and lightning way, but more of the sort of thing where I recognised I wanted to do more in my life than go to meetings and make money.

What drew you to Unitarianism? Was there any kind of faith struggle or was the transition to Unitarianism a smooth one?

Unitarianism is just about the only religion I can even imagine being part of. It’s the one faith that encourages you to think for yourself and welcome all the different perspectives. That’s what I needed…  I wasn’t going for any group that said ‘believe this wacky story and you’ll go to heaven’.  I mean really!

I’ve only recently been made aware of the Unitarian community within the United Kingdom but have known of the UU’s (Unitarian Universalists) in the United States for a good while now. Why do you think there are so few groups within the UK?

If you do the maths, the Unitarians here make up about the same fraction of the religious population as do UUs in the US. It’s just that very view people in the UK really ‘do’ religion at all, and of course, the population is smaller.

The bigger question for me is why are there so few Unitarians or UUs in general. We only make up about 0.1% of the US population.

At the beginning of the 19th century, Thomas Jefferson – who was very much a rationalist – was so confident that Unitarianism was the only sensible religion that he wrote “I trust there is not a young man alive today who will not die a Unitarian.”  Well, he didn’t count on the strength of irrational belief, I suppose. I remain hopeful – especially since I’ve seen the incredible growth in my own congregation and know the kind of appeal this kind of radically-inclusive community can have for people – especially young adults.

I’ve lost count of the amount of people who tell me they’re spiritual yet not religious and are struggling to find their spiritual home or have given up altogether – what can be done to bring about more awareness of Unitarianism to these people and to society in general?

To be fair, not all Unitarian congregations are really ready to embrace the ‘spiritual but not religious’ set. Mine is – very much so – but Unitarian congregations are democratic and self-governing. This means that there is huge variation between them. While mine is relatively young and very eclectic, some others consist of a handful of elderly people doing the same things they did 50 years ago or more. I don’t want everyone going to their nearest congregation looking for Reiki because they’re going to be disappointed in a lot of them.

For the rest – for congregations like mine – we have our work cut out for us helping people recognise that there’s a kind of religion that isn’t like the rest. It’s a big challenge but I think it’s really starting to happen in places like Islington and Stoke Newington.

How do you view what many term’ God?’

As a minister, I’m pretty careful not to tell people exactly what I think because I would not want them to be influenced by my views – which are no better than any others really. And this is pretty easy for me because I don’t know exactly what I mean by that term. In fact, it changes from day to day!

There’s a very strong tradition that supports the idea of *not* understanding the divine. It is supposed to be ineffable – unknowable and unapproachable. Remember that whole business in the Bible where Moses couldn’t look upon the face of the divine? For Jews, the name of the divine is unmentionable and no one even knows how to say it! In Hinduism, all those Avatars are understood to be mere symbols of a single incomprehensible, unknowable divine entity. So I’m in good company not defining the divine!

The most useful thing for me is to recognise that life is sacred, that the divine is within each one of us, and that if it is anything, it is what leads us toward love, justice, and peace. When we are moving in the right direction, we are in harmony with the divine.

Could you tell me about your own congregation? When did your involvement there begin?

I arrived in 2006 as a student minister. I imagined I’d just be here for a couple of years and just wanted to do the work I needed to do to complete my US ministry studies. And then, this congregation needed someone to fill a gap and would I take it for a year and ‘please, try not to destroy it.’  Well, we grew about 30% that first year. They asked me to stay. Over my first two and a half years, we doubled our membership. It’s been great fun!

Could you tell me a bit about the structure of a service? In what ways does it mirror a more traditional service and in what ways does it differ?

It looks fairly traditional in many ways – we have hymns and readings and a sermon – but all of the content is different. We celebrate and draw upon many different traditions.  And that includes a lot of secular material – especially poetry.  We talk about the big issues of life – all the things that real people wrestle with, and we recognise that no one is going to make it right for us – we have got to act.

Have you received any animosity towards what you do due to the nature of the spiritual community to which you belong? I ask because some followers of other faiths believe there to be only one correct way to connect to/with God.

No, not really. The only time was a written response to our decision not to perform legal marriages for any couples until we could do the same for all couples (gay and straight). The response was about 99% positive with one crank email!

As well as your Sunday morning meeting, what other activities do you offer within New Unity?

We do a poetry and meditation programme every Wednesday evening and silent meditation every Tuesday. Right now I’m running a nine-week series of workshops that focus on discovering and deepening your own spirituality. We have Wheel of the Year celebrations on the Solstices, Equinoxes, and cross-quarter days, and a monthly alternative service called Resonance. And there are less frequent things like our annual Passover Seder meal and Christmas services… Makes me tired just to say it all…

How do Unitarians differ from others of faith with regards their ethos?

The main thing is that we deliberately cultivate diversity in spirituality. We don’t only tolerate having a mix of beliefs in our congregations, we actually want that. We think that the encounter with difference is how we learn and grow. It’s boring to be with people who all think alike! A famous Unitarian of the 16th century said “we need not think alike to love alike.”  That pretty much sums it up.

Your fellowship is very accepting of diversity. As an example, I can see you have a rainbow flag on your site so you’re obviously gay-friendly?

Yes, our congregation and the Unitarian movement at large have stated clearly and repeatedly that we consider LGBT people welcome and equal to all others within our congregations. We have many gay and lesbian members and our movement has quite a few gay and lesbian clergy and lay leaders.

In some ways, the gay issue is a much easier one than the class issue. Class is a reality not just here, but in the US too and I think people are more welcoming of someone with a different sexual orientation, skin colour, ethnicity, ability or age than they are of someone with a different level of education and affluence.  I’m happy to say that my congregation does include class diversity, but it is one of the most important challenges that all of us face.

From the website header which features many different icons of faith, I can see that New Unity embraces many paths to what people would term God or a Higher Power. Does that mean that people from all faith positions can find a home within New Unity or is one placed higher above the others? Do you celebrate special calendar dates within different faith perspectives or do you keep each service generalised and therefore inclusive to all in terms of belief?

First, let me be clear that belief in a higher power is not required. We have Humanists and Atheists among us and they belong as much as anyone else. (Remember that some Eastern religions can also be effectively atheistic).  Yes, people of any faith position are welcome but open-mindedness and tolerance are also required, so some people who are very certain that there is only one right way wouldn’t find it a very amenable environment.

As for the services, you’ve hit on exactly why it’s hard to be a Unitarian Minister! We do celebrate special calendar dates, and we often do that from the perspective of ‘what can we learn from this particular observance?’ Recently, a service fell at the conjunction of Eid ul Fitr, Rosh Hashanah, and Autumn Equinox. We celebrated these each in our own ways and the service focused on a sense of newness that comes with the Jewish New Year, the end of fasting for Ramadan, and the change of seasons.

Other services start from the perspective of a particular question or life issue and then ask what we can learn from the teachings of a wide range of traditions.

Could you tell me about UKSpirituality? How did that come about? What are the aims of the programme? How do you see it developing in the future?

You asked me earlier how we can help people learn about Unitarianism. UKSpirituality started just that way – by asking how can we help people find the ‘spiritual but not religious’ programmes that we already run. Now, UKSspirituality has become much broader. It has a Unitarian ethos, but includes spirituality programmes sponsored by all sorts of groups. Our goal is to help people find the good stuff out of all the rich and wacky diversity of 21st century spirituality. We will only list programmes that are truly non-dogmatic, inclusive, and open-minded.

Andy, I believe you did a ‘reverse collection’? Could you tell me about that?

Instead of collecting money to support the congregation one Sunday morning, I passed around baskets containing about £100 in coin. I asked people to take it and use it to make a better world. The only thing the reporters wanted to know is ‘will you do this every week?’

Newington Green Unitarian Church has a lot of history attached to it….(again leaving this open). I believe early feminist Mary Wollstonecraft was a prominent congregant?

It’s a place of amazing history. In the 18th century, they were fighting against monarchies and fomenting revolution!  They were envisioning equal rights for women.  It seems very appropriate that today, we are fighting for equal rights for LGBT people.

In an increasingly secular and some would argue, fragmented society, where do you see Unitarianism slotting in within that?

The Unitarian ethos can be an answer that turns the challenges of living in a multicultural society into an asset that makes all of us stronger and more whole human beings.

Do you think there will come a time when there will be a Unitarian church or chapel in every town up and down the land?

My wish would be that the Unitarian ethos of radical inclusiveness and a belief in the worth and dignity of all people would spread throughout the land. If there can also be vibrant diverse communities of faithful people committed to supporting one another in their spiritual journeys, I would be a very satisfied man – whether those communities are called ‘Unitarian’ or not.

Thank you Andy for a thoroughly enjoyable and thought-provoking interview.

Rev Andrew Pakula
Newington Green and Islington Unitarians
Director, UKSpirituality

Andy also has a blog Throw Yourself Like A Seed

You can also follow Andy on Twitter.

Natalie King

I believe you were raised in an old people’s home as both your parents were nurses – what are your recollections of that?

Many and varied! I didn’t know it was strange to live in an old people’s home when I was little. Both my parents trained as nurses but my father became the matron of an old people’s home just before he married my mother, and we all (dad, mum brother and sister) lived there until I was 16. Most of my memories are about Christmases – they were important to my dad and we never had Christmas dinner early he was always downstairs working. I over heard him talking to one his staff about it once and she couldn’t understand why he put such effort into it. He explained to her that his mother was still in Barbados and he would want someone to look after her if she was ever in a home – and the standard that he expected for her he should give to other people’s parents.

You now live in Brighton. What drew you there and what do you like/dislike about living in Brighton?

Simple – university! I came down here, met a man and liked the sea and I haven’t left! I love Brighton and now have spent most of my life here – the only dislike is the crowded beaches in the summer.

We met through Facebook because you’re a Robben Ford fan. Funnily enough, I discovered Robben whilst living in Brighton. I heard his album Mystic Mile playing in HMV on Western Road and just had to have it. How did you find out about him? You’ve seen him live haven’t you? What’s your favourite album/song of his?

My husband played me some of his music and just fell in love – it was the Supernatural album. I’ve seen him live 3 times (the best gigs were in the Jazz Cafe – I can actually say I have been inside a smoky jazz club!) I love the track Supernatural – especially live. And I am quite partial to the Blue Moon Album with Handful of Blues in a very close 2nd!

What bands/musicians are you into and what are you playing lots of currently?

I am listening to quite a lot at the min and it’s all quite varied. I am loving Sharon Jones and The Dap Kings, Joe Bonamassa – The Sloe Gin album and am reliving my teen years by listening to Soundgarden and Guns N Roses – sad but there you have it! To be honest any music is good – if it moves you, listen to it.

You’re musical yourself aren’t you? What instruments do you play and what attracted you to them? How long have you been playing? You’re left-handed, does this mean you approach playing differently?

I really wouldn’t describe myself as a musician, I play the way that those who have been taught play – doggedly! I can play piano and clarinet and have been known to play a church organ!

You were also in a choir, does this influence what you listen to and how you play?

No not at all – it makes you appreciate that it takes many talents to make music.

You’ve been married for 2 years although you’ve been with your husband since you were 19. How did you meet and was it love at first sight?

We met at work (he was my supervisor) and yes it was.

You love animals. Could you tell me about the menagerie you had as a child?

Oh man – we had so many animals so here goes. An Alsatian, an English Sheep Dog, 2 rabbits called Snowy and Ashely (can you guess what colours they were?), 6 chicken, 2 ducks, 1 cockerel and 2 turkey – that were decidedly psycho! There were also many assorted fish. (And to say I love animals is stretching it – your purchasing power as a child is limited and these were ALL pets my father bought us).

You’re quite accident prone also….

I was certainly so as a child – and I have the assorted battle scars to prove it. The most memorable it “the potato story”. I wanted to help my mum cook and she wouldn’t let me I begged and begged and begged and finally she relented. So she gave me a wet potato, a dinner plate and dinner knife thinking that would fox me! Ha! I went in to my dad’s fishing tackle box and got his gutting knife. I put the potato on my knee and cut it in half – no obviously to my young mind half a potato is too big, so I got one of the halves placed it on the same knee (which was the left one) and cut it again. At this point I got bored. I left the kitchen with a trail of blood behind me. My dad found me later with blood all down my leg at which point he got the 1st aid kit. It wasn’t until the antiseptic was on my cut did I realise what I had done – I still have the scar and it’s about 3 inches long!

Could you tell me a little about your education. You have a degree I believe?

Bog standard I’m afraid – I went to the local comp and got my GCSE’s stayed on the 6th form for my A Levels – which I balls up (but my father did pass away only a few months before my exams) and went on to do my degree. I read Public Policy and Administration – which while useful has no bearing on my current work.

What do you do in terms of work? Do you enjoy it? What drew you to it as a career choice?

I am a cinema manager and yes I love it (like all jobs it has some good days and some bad) I kind of fell into it, like I said my degree would have placed me towards a civil service career but I really didn’t want to go down that route and I happened to like the manager I worked for in my cinema and wanted to work for him.

Growing up, did you experience any racism having come from a mixed race background?

Looking back I did as a child have experiences of racism that was more direct, and to be honest I have been one of the lucky ones, the experiences that I had were so few and far between that they are remarkable for that fact. My mother is Indian and as a child with a heritage that is Afro Caribbean / Indian the thing I remember most is that most people if they met me and my dad (or indeed him with me and my brother and sister) they accepted he could have a mixed race daughter / children, but with my mother there were more “looks”. I don’t remember anyone saying anything but you can get a sense of things. I would point out that my mum and dad had a rainbow family before Ange and Brad!

Where do you think racism stems from and do you think it can ever be fully eradicated from society?

I comes from so many different places, ignorance and fear are the big ones. The main thing that think is that most people have “learnt” these attitudes from parents, family, friends. I think that yes it can be eradicated -but we are a long way off from that. Having said all of that I never thought I would see a Black president of the USA.

I have personally never understood bigotry, in any form. What possible purpose can it serve to hold onto such irrational beliefs and prejudices?

You know I can’t answer that as I really don’t have a good enough answer – the person who can will be able to do a lot of good in the world.

How would you describe yourself in 5 words?

Outgoing, Funny, Loyal, Determined, Sexy.

What is your greatest achievement?

Working with my dyslexia – having it diagnosed helped me understand so much about the way I learn and gave me techniques especially it gave me the understanding so that I learned to love reading as a pleasure – even though it wasn’t diagnosed until I was at university.

Are you currently reading any books? Do you have a favourite author?

I have just finished reading “The Dark River” by John Twelve Hawks, it’s the second in his 4th Realm trilogy and I can’t wait for the final book – “The Golden City”. Seriously I have it on pre-order! I read a variety of authors now (as I said my dyslexia was diagnosed when I was 19 at the start of my 2nd year of university and I have been making up for lost time ever since then). I go through phases of reading particular authors but the one that I go back to time and again is Amy Tan (author of The Joy Luck Club).

What do you like to do to relax?

Oh lots of things – gym, swim, spend time with my god kids (of which I have 7), eating – I love eating, drinking, sleeping (and usually in that order)- I think I was a lion in a past life I really shouldn’t sleep this much!) and now reading is a new passion. Going to any music event, from gigs, opera even watching the ballet for the music! BTW I thoroughly recommend that people see a group called “The Hamsters” if that is the only band they see – they are soooooo worth it!

What has been the greatest lesson learned in life so far?

You cannot un-ring a bell and also Just because you don’t see me pray doesn’t mean that I don’t believe.

Do you have any heroes/heroines?

I don’t think Spiderman counts – but as a kid I thought he was amazing. I have a friend Ruthanne – she is definitely a heroine of mine.

If you live anywhere in the world, where would it be and why?

I am happy here in Brighton! But I did love Mauritius – it’s where we got married, and I have happy memories of there. I loved Long Island but I am happy any place where I am with friends (god that is sickly sweet!) and family

If you could do or be anything, what would that be?

Learn another language, I would also like to be more patient!

Where do you see yourself in 5 year’s time?

Perfecting the art of being me! I think that some many people concentrate on what is coming they forget to enjoy what is here. I have watched so many friends wanting to make the opportunity happen they forget to make the most the ones that they have now

What type of films do you enjoy watching? What’s your favourite film? Favourite actor/actress?

I will watch anything (although being a cinema manager means that I try to avoid the cinema when it’s busy), I love anything that will engage me. My favourite film – most recently – has been Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon, and after that was Walk The Line – I am quite partial to the Coen Brothers. Favourite Actor is Jeff Goldblum and Actress is Kyra Sedgewick.

Are you politically inclined?

Yes – but my politics are personal, in so much as I think that we have a voice and we must use it, it is criminal not to vote. It is important to use the power of your vote – apathy is the enemy of the decent man.

How important is family to you?

Very – but I suppose given the recent news headlines (with children killing children) go to show I am one of the lucky ones. But we don’t live in each others pockets.

As a cinema manager, you will have experienced the growth of multiplexes. What’s your view of them? Where do they leave the small independent cinemas?

I think (and I am biased) that anything that gets bums on seats is a good thing. It is important to remember that there is a place for those venues that cater for the less mainstream as well. I will say that more importantly in the past few years that there has been a growth in multiplexes showing less mainstream films and that is a good thing. I truly believe that people will always attend those old cinemas – but as an industry we must ensure that they are kept open for this to happen.

Do you currently follow a spiritual tradition?

Yes – but it very much like my politics, it is personal I think God is the “thing” that speaks to you in a way that others can’t.

What’s your favourite meal/beverage/tipple?

Roast Chicken / Coffee (or Tea – depending on mood), Ooooooo I am just like Mme Bollinger it is Champagne “I drink it when I’m happy and when I’m sad. Sometimes I drink it when I’m alone. When I have company I consider it obligatory. I trifle with it if I’m not hungry and drink it when I am. Otherwise, I never touch it – unless I’m thirsty.” However when the purse strings are tight a Rosé will suffice.

Do you know the meaning of your name and how apt is it do you feel?

It means Christmas Child – but I was born at the height of summer but my mother was pregnant at Christmas – so I suppose it is apt.

Have you ever been on the Volk’s Electric Railway in Brighton and if so, what did you think of it?

Yes quite a few times but the 2 most memorable involve my younger brother. The 1st was when he was quite small (4 or 5 years old) there is a mid stop on the train and for what ever reason he decided that he had enough of being on it and decided to get off – after it had started to move! Needless to say my parents nearly died! He couldn’t see what he had done wrong. The 2nd was a couple of years ago he and his girlfriend decided to come down to Brighton for the day and the Saturday that they chose was the 1st one in August (Gay Pride). They decided to take a ride on the Volk’s with me – my brother turned to me and said “Nat there are an awful lot of men here – and quite a few wearing pink. Is there a football game on or something?” I nearly fell off my seat as I had to explain that is was pride weekend. “Oh” he said ” that explains the pink cowboy hats. Couldn’t work out what they had to do with football.”

And a final random question for you … are you a (biccie) dunker?

Of course – it would be rude not to be!

Thank you Natalie for a stunning interview.

]]> http://tellingithowitis.wordpress.com/2009/09/14/natalie-king-interview/feed/ 0 Jonathan nataliekings http://tellingithowitis.wordpress.com/2009/06/01/caroline-jones-creasey-interview/ http://tellingithowitis.wordpress.com/2009/06/01/caroline-jones-creasey-interview/#comments Mon, 01 Jun 2009 18:42:15 +0000 Jonathan http://tellingithowitis.wordpress.com/?p=35 ]]> Caroline Creasey is 30 years of age and based in Australia.   She lives with Tourette Syndrome.  She returned to study this year and is happily married for the second time around.  She took time out of her schedule to be interviewed.  Thank you Caroline.

Whereabouts were you born?

I was born in New Orleans, Louisiana, U.S.A.  I was supposed to be born in Scotland a month later, but my parents miscalculated the due date.

Do you have any brothers and sisters?

I have a younger brother.  When he came home from the hospital I thought Mum and Dad had bought me a new toy: one that went “meep” when I poked him.  He now has four children, but still goes “meep” when I poke him!

You’ve spoken about living with Tourette Syndrome. When was this first noticed and did you get a swift diagnosis?

I first showed tics at age 3 months, an eye scrunching tic.  My parents (who were on their first child, and therefore panicked about everything) took me to an optometrist, who tested my vision and found it to be fine.  I then had tics, very little ones and intermittently up until I was 12.

Then the Obsessive Compulsive Disorder kicked in, and I began to worry about taps being left on, and leaving books at my desk.  The stress of not being able to control these urges lead to my tics coming out in full force.  I was taken to a Psychologist, two Psychiatrists, and an Ophthalmologist before I saw a Dr Marriage (Psychiatric Neurologist) who diagnosed me in about three seconds.

How does your TS manifest? Are other conditions present alongside your TS? Do you take meds to control your tics?

My TS is quite well controlled these days.  I have a head shaking one, which looks to people like I’m disagreeing with them, and I also rub my feet together before falling asleep. The feet rubbing has happened since I was 8, and has actually shortened my Achilles tendon on my left side, so I hobble first thing in the morning!

I also, when very stressed, grunt or burp.  For most of my tics, I don’t have any warning that they are about to occur, or that they have occurred.  All the tics that were associated with a feeling of “wrongness” are stopped by my medication.  I take the anti-psychotic Abilify for the tics, and for my co-morbid Major Depression, Anxiety, and Obsessive Compulsive disorder I take Zoloft.  I used to be on quite high doses (30mg Abilify and 300mg Zoloft) but since life has taken a happier turn, I’m only on 5mg of Abilify and 50mg of Zoloft.   My Depression, especially is much better these days.

You’ve spoken about having gone through major Depression in high school. Do you feel that schools do enough to cater for young people who are experiencing depression?

Um, yes and no.  I’ve found that schools are very good at dealing with Depression, as long as you tell them about it.  Never expect a teacher to ask “are you ok?” and never expect them to treat you any differently without a Doctor’s certificate.  The real problem about my Depression in High School was I didn’t know I was Depressed…I though everyone felt like I did.  It actually took me writing an essay in English class which said I sat up crying every night before my peers noticed and said “that’s not normal”.

At what age did you leave school and what were your future plans? Did you go to university?

I left high school in the best possible way, finishing final year with a score in the top 5% of my state.  I wanted, more than ever, to study at Swinburne University where their BSc had a neurology stream that specifically mentioned Tourette’s Syndrome as a major.  However, my parents didn’t approve, saying I should do a degree at “One of the Big Three” Universities.  I agreed and went to Monash, where I had a great first year, and a nightmare second year.  Then I dropped out.  I’ve tried three times to complete my degree; no luck.  The subjects are now too old to be counted as credit, so if I went back I’d have to start again.  I still dream of going back though.

How important are family, friends and loved ones to you?

Very.  Perhaps more than is healthy.  I recently moved into “the bush” to give myself a bit of perspective from my family and friends.  And while I miss them dearly, the four hour drive means I’m not quite as compelled to drop everything and come over when there’s a “crisis”.

Could you tell me about your website?

I started, in 1997, a website called Tourette Syndrome 101.  It was a two page site, written in Microsoft Frontpage.  I knew very little about computers at that stage, but loved the internet and realized that all the sites online at the time were Tourette Syndrome Association ones.  I wanted to start a site by a “Touretter” (I don’t like saying sufferer, because we don’t always suffer) for other “touretters”.

Since it was first done, it has grown to about 30 pages, gotten a very strong genetic component (as I was studying genetics at Uni) and been changed to TS101.  It has recently moved to the new address www.tourette101.com as the Geocities service which used to host it for free is closing.  I now have to pay to host it, but I think it’s worth it.  I get a lot of good feedback from it, and have actually been able to expand on the theories with people’s input.

You have recommenced study, what subject(s) are you taking?

I’m actually ignoring science all together and am studying I.T. at Tafe level.  It’s been really good, not only because I can use the information on my website, but because it has shown me that I can get back to study and not have panic attacks.

You perform on stage I believe?

Yes, I did my first musical at age 6.  I haven’t done any since I moved up to “The bush” as there aren’t any theatre companies near here…but I do plan to start one.  I’m in discussion with the shire council to let me hire their hall and do some advertising.  Could be good!  But yes, I have 3 years of tap-dancing, a grade 4 Trinity Exam in Singing, and have acted for ages.

You’re now 30. Is there any truth to the old adage that Life Begins At 30?

I’m hoping so!  My life has been wonderful and terrible for the last 30 years, so I’m hoping that things will actually work in my favor for a change.  I have a new husband, have just bought a house, and am looking at a new career.  I also have a lot of experience now which helps me to survive what can sometimes be a tough life.

What do you like to do to relax?

I love social networking.  I hop on the Internet and chat to family, friends, and just random strangers for hours.  However, to really relax, I either go for a jog, or plug myself into my ipod and leave reality.  (There are sometimes advantages to TS, one of which is an awesome imagination!)

What advice would you give to young people who are living with TS?

You are not TS.  Ts is your brain’s chemicals playing up a bit.  If you feel stressed, anxious, Depressed or self conscious, talk to other people.  You’ll soon find that all these “normal” friends of yours have issues too.  And if someone can’t understand your TS they’re not worth knowing.

What is your greatest achievement?

Learning to love myself.  At the height of my Depression I was a cheated on wife, at 106kgs, on a disability pension, who couldn’t leave the house.  The more I realized that anyone who was worth talking to loved me because I was wonderful, the more I got over those hurdles.  I have my brother to thank for that.  He has his own issues, but his catchphrase throughout school was “Of course, I’m gorgeous”.  Now I know why.  Even if it seems dumb, saying that sort of thing out loud makes you believe it.  And when you believe it, you can change the world.

As you’re based in Australia, What’s your favourite type of Tim-Tam?

LOL!  I’m on a diet…how cruel!  Um, they aren’t always around, but the strawberry “breast cancer foundation” tim-tams are my faves.

I loved this interview.  Thank you Caroline for agreeing to take part.

Caroline’s website dedicated to TS can be found here:-

http://www.tourette101.com/

What was/were the trigger(s) which made you begin to question your sexual identity?  Was it one of those eureka moments or was it a succession of moments/events which brought you to the realisation of who and what you were/are?  Was it a relief to discover the truth about who you were/are?

I think I always knew in my heart from about 12 years old.  Did I accept it?  Definitely not given my upbringing in conservative upstate New York and my traditional Catholic background.  It was only after a chance event that I found myself forced to face the reality of my true sexual orientation.  Yes, after the initial freaking out phase, it was a huge relief and I truly felt as if a huge weight had been taken off me.

I know you’ve touched upon the difficulties contained within making the very personal decision to come out and live truthfully and you went through an incredibly painful divorce.  Was there ever a point during that process when you thought it would have been easier to just go back to living as you had been or were you resolute in your convictions from the outset and determined to see it through no matter what?

During the coming out process I think many of us have our moments during which we wonder if life would have been easier if we had stayed in the closet.  But overall, I knew that I could not go back in the closet.  In fact, the ex-wife  told me to either go back in the closet and pretend nothing had happened or to get out and I decided that I had to move out.  I simply knew that I could no longer live my life as an actor playing a role others dictated for me.

What comes across clearly through your blog are your religious convictions.  Some would argue that being a practising gay person and a Christian are wholly incompatible?  What would you say to those people?

I do not think being gay and Christian are wholly incompatible.  The key is to leave a faith tradition if it is anti-gay and find one that is gay affirming.  In my own case, I left the Roman Catholic church in which I had been raised and joined the Lutheran Church (the Evangelical Church in America – not the Missouri Synod Lutheran Church which is reactionary and anti-gay).  I have a number of gay/lesbian friends who are Episcopalian and very involved in their respective churches.  I’d also add that I suspect Christ would condemn anti-gay Christians as he condemned the Pharisees in the Gospels.

There are those within the Christian movement who peddle misinformation and occasional lies about the LGBT community.  How does this affect your own spiritual worldview?  Has your faith ever faltered due to the resistance and sometimes outright hostility gay people as a collective have to face as well as you the individual?  Or has it in some ways strengthened your beliefs?

The constant, deliberate lies of the Christianists as I call them here in the USA can take a toll on one’s spirituality and there have been times I have stayed away from church when I have grown impatient with the ELCA Lutheran’s not being even more gay affirming than they are – at least in this synod.  I do think that LGBT Christians often end off with stronger faith because we have had to think and reflect far more on matters of faith given the hostility we experience from the Christianists.

You’ve mentioned about being an out professional in a relatively conservative area.  What are some of the challenges you have to face because of that?

The first challenge I faced was that I was forced out of a larger law firm my prior law firm was merging with because the powers that be did not want an openly gay partner.  My existence might offend some of their bigoted clients.  Of course, they dressed it up as something other than anti-gay bigotry, but I knew what was really going on based on previous comments and incidents.

Part of the reason I started my own firm was so that I could be open and honest about who I am without flaunting it and also so that I could aggressively market to the LGBT community.  I now have a gay paralegal as well and a sizeable LGBT client base.  My sub-tenant, the ELCA Bishop for Virginia, and my straight client base seem to have no issue with my sexual orientation.  Neither do my Hindu and Muslim clients – they are concerned with my competence as an attorney, not who I love.

Another facet of your life which positively shines through your writings is the fact you’re a parent.  How has your relationship with your children been affected by your decision to live honestly and openly as a gay man?

I am the proud parent of three children: a daughter 20, a son almost 24, and a daughter, 27.  Other than the extreme nastiness of the divorce, I’d say that my coming out has improved our relationship.  I am less moody, less angry, and more conscious of needing to be a loving father than when I was in the closet racked with self-hate and self-loathing.  My youngest child recently commented on my blog that she saw it as a positive for the whole family (I suspect the ex-wife might not agree).

You’re an Attorney At Law, have you faced any discrimination within the legal community because of your decision to be open about who you are in the workplace?

As I noted above, I was basically forced out of a law firm for being gay.  Anti-gay bigotry is alive and well in South-East Virginia.

Do you personally represent people in the LGBT communities who have faced/are facing discrimination in the workplace?  What are the key concerns faced by people who are out and gay in the workplace?

Yes, I do represent clients from the LGBT community who are facing employment discrimination.  Unfortunately, Virginia has no state law employment non-discrimination protections.  Similarly, Federal Law provides no employment non-discrimination protections.  The result is that employees of privately owned businesses have no protections and are routinely fired or demoted for being gay.  State employees have supposed protections under an executive order of the Governor of Virginia and I am currenly handling a case of a gay man who was fired by the Virginia Museum of Natural History for being gay.  We are still awaiting the court’s ruling in that case.

There are a lot of people who are aware of their sexuality and wish to come out and be themselves but are afraid of the consequences of that, in their own lives and their workplaces.  What advice would you give them?

Through my blog there are times I receive messages from closeted gays.  Some are more worried about keeping their material possessions than living honestly.  For me – and I lost just about everything in the divorce case – finding self-acceptance and being able to at long last just be who I am is beyond value.  Coming out in mid-life after being married with children is not an easy journey.  Ultimately, each person needs to decide what are the most important things to them and then act accordingly.

America has a new President in the form of Barack Obama.  Do you feel more hopeful in terms of better legal rights for gay people and/or those in same sex relationships?

I supported Obama’s campaign and even allowed his local campaign staff during the Virginia primary to use my law office for phone banking and making photocopies, etc.  And I did feel more hopeful at first with his election, but so far Obama has been a huge disappointment in terms of LGBT rights issues.  Yes, I’d rather see him as president as opposed to John McCain – especially with the delusional Sarah Palin as his Vice President -  but I am increasingly concerned that Obama’s lofty pro-gay campaign statements were a cynical way to garner LGBT votes and money.  Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell needs to be repealed NOW.  Likewise we need federal employment non-discrimination laws passed NOW.  I am hoping Obama will prove me wrong, but only action will convince me that he actually meant what he said during the campaign.

What do you think has been the single biggest stumbling block in terms of better and wider recognition of the rights of gay people in America today, both within the political world and in mainstream society?

Without a doubt the biggest stumbling block has been the opposition by the “Christian” Right and what I call the professional Christian set.  These people lie, spread knowingly false information and use gays as a way to raise money from the ignorant and uninformed and as a wedge issue in politics.  If we had a more responsible news media that had the guts to expose the deliberate lies of these people and organizations, their power could be broken quickly.  Unfortunately, due to a fear of appearing “anti-religion” and the ever more prevalent hiring of news anchors for their looks as opposed to brains, the media fails to be responsible and tell the larger real truth about the self-styled “Godly Christians.”  Meanwhile, gay affirming denominations get little news exposure.

You’ve obviously been though a lot in terms of getting married, realising who you are, a bitter divorce and so on and so forth.  Is there anyone special in your life at the moment?  If so, what differences has this made to you?

I have a very wonderful man in my life currently and we have been together for a little over ten months although we have known each other socially for roughly five years.  His name is Barry.  First, I’d have to say that he loves me and cares for me more than anyone has before – certainly more than the ex-wife ever did – and that he is a huge emotional support for me.  He is sweet, caring, compassionate and has a heart of gold.  He is also very cute!  We have been living together on a trial basis at his home – I have tenants in my house right now – for about a month and so far we seem pretty compatible.  I have always wanted a relationship that feels complete (something that was impossible in a straight marriage) and I believe I have found it at last.  He means the world to me.  I think at some point we will get married in Canada or one of the North Eastern states that allows same sex marriage even though it would not be recognized in Virginia.

A wonderful interview.  Thank you Michael.

http://michael-in-norfolk.blogspot.com/
http://www.hamarlaw.com

Paul Harfleet is a Manchester-based artist who in 2005 devised and created The Pansy Project.  With it he revisits locations where homophobia has been experienced and plants pansies.

Paul Harfleet - Artist and Activist

Could you tell me a bit about The Pansy Project? How did that come about? I presume you’re reclaiming the term ‘pansy’ with your project title – what strengths do pansies (the plants) have and how does this feature within what you do? You use self-seeding pansies I see.

A string of homophobic abuse was the catalyst for The Pansy Project. The day began with two builders shouting; “it’s about time we went gaybashing again isn’t it?”; continued with a gang of young boys throwing abuse and stones at my then boyfriend and me, and ended with a bizarre and unsettling confrontation with a man who called us ‘ladies’ under his breath.

Over the years I have become accustomed to this kind of behaviour, but I came to realise it was a shocking concept to most of my friends and colleagues.

It was in this context that I began to ponder the nature of these verbal attacks and their influence on my life. I realised that I felt differently about these experiences depending on my mental state so I decided to explore the way I was made to feel at the location where these incidents occur. What interested me was the way that the locations later acted as a prompt for me to consider the memories associated with that place. I wanted in some way to manipulate these associations, In order to feel differently about the location and the memories it summoned.

I became interested in the public nature of these incidents and the way one was forced into reacting publicly to an event that often occurred during the day and in full view of passers by. I had observed the tendency to place flowers at the scene of a crime or accident had become an accepted ritual and I considered a similar response. Floral tributes subtly augment the reading of a space that encourages a passerby to ponder past events at a marked location, generally understood as a crime or accident; my particular intervention could encourage a passerby to query the reason for my own ritualistic action.

However, I did not feel it would be appropriate to equate my personal experience of verbal homophobic abuse with a death or fatal accident; I felt that planting a small unmarked living plant at the site would correspond with the nature of the abuse: A plant continues to grow as I do through my experience. Placing a live plant felt like a positive action, it was a comment on the abuse; a potential ‘remedy’.

The species of plant was of course vitally important and the pansy instantly seemed perfect. Not only does the word refer to an effeminate or gay man: The name of the flower originates from the French verb; pensar (to think), as the bowing head of the flower was seen to visually echo a person in deep thought. The subtlety and elegiac quality of the flower was ideal for my requirements. The action of planting reinforced these qualities, as kneeling in the street and digging in the often neglected hedgerows felt like a sorrowful act. The bowing heads of the flowers became mournful symbols of indignant acceptance.

So my eventual strategy would be to plant unmarked pansies as close as possible to where I received verbal homophobic abuse.  I would then entitle the location after the abuse and post a photograph of the pansy alongside the quoted abuse online.

What was originally an autobiographical work has become a project that has been embraced by the gay community, who seem to see the project as way to deal with a shared experience as many members of the LGBT community have experienced bullying or abuse at some point. Events where I have handed out pansies for people to memorialise their own locations have been well attended as have sessions I have hosted which have been designed to introduce the project to a wider audience.

My research has revealed that the process of planting a pansy at the scene of these incidents alters the participant’s experience of the city. The memorialised locations primarily become a place where the participant has planted a pansy, not where an attack has occurred. This action adjusts the memory of each location which has the effect of overlaying the remembered event in the mind of the participants with a more positive association.

The website enables the images of the ephemeral acts to be collated and presented to a wide audience who can then vicariously explore the nature of the incidents. The juxtaposition of the images of the delicate flowers placed in derelict urban settings with frequently offensive and hurtful abuse creates a complex anthology of homophobic verbal abuse as experienced by gay people in towns and cities today. The humble planted pansy becomes a record; a trace of this public occurrence which is deeply personal and concurrently available to the public on the city streets and on-line.

When verbal homophobic abuse is experienced the assailant forces the unwilling participant to assimilate and respond to this public verbal attack; ignore or retaliate? The Pansy Project acts as a formula which prevents the ‘victim’ from internalising the incident, the strategy becomes a conceptual shield; a behaviour that enables the experience to be processed via the public domain in this case the location where the incident occurred and latterly the website which collates ands presents the incidents and operates as a virtual location of quiet resistance.

What is your main aim with the project?

As an artist my main aim is to encourage an audience to consider the notion of homophobia and its effects. Primarily I hope that it is a thought provoking artwork, the political element of the project is a welcome addition to the project, though with this in mind I have resisted The Pansy Project evolving into a singularly political strategy of raising awareness of the continued experience of homophobia. I hope to continue exploring the project and the complex issues it confronts.

What motivates you to keep going when there are so many homophobic incidences occurring, many of them not getting the attention they fully deserve and of course many going unreported altogether?

It is the continued homophobic incidences that motivate me. My own experiences of homophobia continue and as news of my project spreads I hope to encourage discussion outside of a ‘gay ghetto’. For me the project is as much about the way we all live our lives, it is not solely an artwork that focuses on gay experience it is as much a work about a straight world as it is about my own world.

Do homophobes sneer at the concept of pansies being utilised within your work?

I am uncomfortable with the term ‘homophobe’ as it demonises the protagonists, it is their behaviour that is offensive and upsetting though to describe them in such a way removes them from the world. Homophobia is present in all of us even those that are gay. It is impossible to live outside of a world that so culturally brain washes its citizens into believing that homosexuality is wrong. It is not uncommon for closeted gay people to display homophobic attitudes before they have the courage to ‘come out’. Though of course the extreme examples of homophobia are easy to latch onto, they only tell a small segment of this incredibly complex and perplexing issue.

The experience of hurtful and homophobic comments on the street is never acceptable though I am able to understand that this behaviour is a expression of a fear and hatred that is an insidious element of contemporary culture that is perpetuated by the media and societal attitudes, I find homophobia is equally as abhorrent when it is displayed by a minority of gay people, a behaviour that is demonstrated with attitudes to effeminate gay men within gay culture. Heterosexual men are eroticised and fetishised to such an extent that effeminacy is chastised and mocked though this perhaps is part of a wider argument regarding cultural misogyny.  It is only when homosexuality can be discussed openly in all its forms that homophobia has a chance of being eradicated from culture. It is far too easy to blame a minority of violent straight attackers when the problem is so widespread and complex.

It is my opinion that it is this complexity that prevents the issues from being explored by the media and why the there is a lack of reporting of homophobic hate crime generally, It could be argued that this is the reason why The Pansy Project too has escaped mass media coverage as it is does not perpetuate a particular notion of gayness. It is both subtle and hard hitting, simple and complex.

How do you feel art can be used to shape and alter attitudes?

Art has a unique ability to raise questions regarding the world in a multitude of ways. The Pansy Project I hope raises questions, it does not solve the problem or even offer solutions it simply invites discussion.

Thank you Paul.

Thanks Jonathan.